[928uk] 3 speed gear change rpm

[todd at oxfordeye.co.uk]

All this fun chat about my bloody 3 speed has reminded me that when I got the car someone had bodged in a thick red cable and toggle switch near the steering wheel. I assumed it was an ignition switch by pass and blindly cut it out (I never traced the wires back to where they were connected - my bad). 

Now Im wondering (since my ignition all seems good and Im been in that area quite a bit) if the switch was actually a kickdown trigger. More when I get in there (and locate the wires I snipped!)

Todd.

-----Original Message-----
From: 928uk <928uk-bounces at lists.928.org.uk> On Behalf Of Paul R Smith via 928uk
Sent: Thursday, June 6, 2024 11:38 AM
To: jonathan at rackowe.net
Cc: 928UK List <928uk at lists.928.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [928uk] 3 speed gear change rpm

Wow, fancy going to the trouble of adding a relay, but not making that switch the inductive load.
I know that the latest cars (perhaps just 94-95) had a throttle movement sensitive version so it kicked down due to fast movement of the pedal as well as WoT, but even then the power to the solenoid is still controlled by the switch.

Note that the "'speedo' FCU relay on the CE panel" is only there on cars after they changed to getting the speed signal from the ABS, up to 1990 they got the speed signal from the reed switch on the back of the diff.

Smiffy

On 06/06/2024 11:10, jonathanrackowe at gmail.com wrote:
> No, on later models all the kickdown solenoid current still passes through the kickdown switch. The kickdown relay on later models was added to allow kickdown to be disconnected electronically in certain circumstances. The kickdown relay contains electronics and receives a speed signal from the 'speedo' FCU relay on the CE panel.
>
> Best regards,
> Jonathan
>
> 1991 928 GT Amethyst Metallic
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: 928uk<928uk-bounces at lists.928.org.uk>  On Behalf Of Paul R Smith 
> via 928uk
> Sent: 06 June 2024 10:29
> To:928uk at lists.928.org.uk
> Subject: Re: [928uk] 3 speed gear change rpm
>
> Makes me wonder if they fitted a relay to later models because the 
> switches were burning out?
> I've sent you the page from the '78 wiring diagram.
>
> Smiffy
>
> On 05/06/2024 20:27, todd via 928uk wrote:
>> Hi Smiffy,
>>
>>    
>>
>> Mine is a 1979 car, so I don’t think it has a kickdown relay? But… I 
>> made a temp fix to shorten the Bowden cable and it now changes at 
>> 4500rpm AND it kicks down. I just need to make a better fix (aka 
>> properly) and adjust the locking bolt on the throttle pressure thing 
>> (side of gearbox that the Bowden cables connects to)
>>
>>    
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Todd.
>>
>>    
>>
>> From: Paul R Smith<smiffypr at gmail.com>   
>> Sent: Wednesday, June 5, 2024 9:39 AM 
>> To:todd at oxfordeye.co.uk;928uk at lists.928.org.uk
>> Subject: Re: [928uk] 3 speed gear change rpm
>>
>>    
>>
>> The next test along this line of investigation is, repeat test with ignition on, can you here a relay click when your pedal operates the switch. You may need to expose the fuse-board to hear it.
>>
>> Smiffy
>>
>> On 04/06/2024 21:33,todd at oxfordeye.co.uk   <mailto:todd at oxfordeye.co.uk>    wrote:
>>
>> Hi Smiffy,
>>    
>> Yes, I hear the click - tested and it does not kick down though. That’s a problem for future Todd.
>>    
>> Todd.
>>    
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: 928uk<mailto:928uk-bounces at lists.928.org.uk>   <928uk-bounces at lists.928.org.uk>   On Behalf Of Paul R Smith via 928uk
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 4, 2024 9:15 AM
>> To:928uk at lists.928.org.uk   <mailto:928uk at lists.928.org.uk>   
>> Subject: Re: [928uk] 3 speed gear change rpm
>>    
>> When you push the pedal the last few mm to the floor (engine/ignition off), can you hear the kickdown switch click?
>>    
>> Smiffy
>>    
>> On 04/06/2024 07:25, toddgibbs111--- via 928uk wrote:
>>
>> Hi Llew,
>>    
>> So, throttle is sharper, zero play. Perhaps a little too tight as I noticed the idle siting at 1100 (I think cable is keeping it open slightly).
>>    
>> Anyway, gear changes at 4100 rpm still.... I'll get under the car today and see what I can find.
>>    
>> Todd.
>>    
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Llewelyn Guildford<mailto:llew.guild at gmail.com>   <llew.guild at gmail.com>
>> Sent: Monday, June 3, 2024 4:50 PM
>> To: Todd Gibbs<mailto:todd at oxfordeye.co.uk>   <todd at oxfordeye.co.uk>
>> Cc: 928<mailto:928uk at lists.928.org.uk>   <928uk at lists.928.org.uk>
>> Subject: Re: [928uk] 3 speed gear change rpm
>>    
>> Hi Todd
>>    
>> No worries, I’ve been there myself with a lot of what you’re doing so it’s quite relaxing viewing from the sidelines!
>>    
>> Can you send a photo?
>>    
>> Let me know what it is like with the throttle cable adjusted , you might find it sorts itself out because the throttle actuator is what pulls on the gearbox shift cable and if it’s too slack it won’t work properly! The gearbox cable is definitely adjustable though, sorry I can’t explain the exact steps.
>>    
>> Llew
>>    
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>    
>>
>> On 3 Jun 2024, at 16:09, Todd Gibbs via 928uk<mailto:928uk at lists.928.org.uk>   <928uk at lists.928.org.uk>    wrote:
>>    
>> Hi Llewelyn
>>    
>> Thanks for watch the videos :)
>>    
>> Ok I’ve had the airbox off again today and there is no adjustment there in mine. I know exactly where you are thinking (there is a hard tube rising from the bell housing that thur cable passes through). Mine just has a flexible cable “shield” that connects to the hard pipe.
>>    
>> I’ve gone back and adjusted the throttle cable, it was slightly loose, and about to test it out….
>>    
>> Thanks and will report back
>>    
>> Todd
>>    
>>
>> On 3 Jun 2024, at 09:42, Llewelyn Guildford<mailto:l.guildford at stemmer-imaging.com>   <l.guildford at stemmer-imaging.com>    wrote:
>>    
>> Hi Todd
>>    
>> I follow your project on YT - Great progress 😊
>>    
>> It's a while since I've done this (2017 I think!) so hopefully my memory serves me semi-well!
>>    
>> The cable is adjustable - Although the adjuster doesn't look obviously so. It seems hard to find an image of it online. The adjuster isn't as an end of the cable, it is half way down. It is located slightly right of centre if you're looking from the front of the car, and is situated behind the airbox on or near the bell housing, so if you take off your airbox and look down behind the bulkhead, standing on the left hand side of the car you should be able to see it. I can't remember in detail exactly how to tension it but it is fairly obvious.
>>    
>> Check list for correct shifting:
>>    
>> Make sure the kickdown switch is working, is adjusted correctly and 
>> that the throttle pedal actuates it at WOT (all this can be done
>> stationary) Make sure the gearbox has the right level of oil in it and that the oil is in reasonable condition I've personally never had to mess around with the vacuum modulator thing on the gearbox and I've had quite a few 3 speed 928s.
>>    
>> Then move on to the cables
>>    
>> Start with the throttle cable and get it tensioned so it's nice and tight but doesn't bind! Once you're happy with that adjust the elusive Bowden cable and you should be good to go.
>>    
>> Gearbox side I would a) not mess with the vac modulator other than to 
>> make sure there are no vacuum leaks b) whatever you've altered on the 
>> cable mount bolt I'd put it back to the original position
>>    
>> 9 times out of 10 gearboxes run perfectly after this.
>>    
>> When you've got a baseline result you can then drive, make a small adjustment to the Bowden cable either way then compare - You'll find your own sweet spot with it!
>>    
>> If you need a hand ever I do find myself in Oxford from time to time so could pop over and have a look with you...
>>    
>> Hope this helps,
>>    
>> Llewelyn
>>    
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: 928uk<mailto:928uk-bounces at lists.928.org.uk>   <928uk-bounces at lists.928.org.uk>    On Behalf Of Ben Hodges
>> via 928uk
>> Sent: Sunday, June 2, 2024 7:12 PM
>> To: Todd Gibbs<mailto:todd at oxfordeye.co.uk>   <todd at oxfordeye.co.uk>
>> Cc: 928 List<mailto:928uk at lists.928.org.uk>   <928uk at lists.928.org.uk>
>> Subject: Re: [928uk] 3 speed gear change rpm
>>    
>> Hi Todd
>>    
>> I’ve sent you a couple of docs that may help - apologies if you 
>> already have them
>>    
>> Cheers
>> Ben
>>    
>>
>> On Sun, 2 Jun 2024 at 16:43, Todd Gibbs via 928uk
>>    <mailto:928uk at lists.928.org.uk>   <928uk at lists.928.org.uk>
>> wrote:
>>    
>> Gents,
>>    
>> Someone put me out of my misery - how do I adjust my 3 speed gearbox 
>> change up rpm?
>>    
>> Currently it changes at 4100rpm.
>>    
>> My Bowden cable is not adjustable, it has press fittings both ends.
>> I’ve adjusted the pressure module and now my gear changes are 
>> punchier (good), but same 4100rpm. I’ve adjust the bolt thing on the 
>> side of the gearbox in the mechanism that the Bowden cable pulls on. 4100rpm still.
>>    
>> So I’m at a loss. What else is there?
>>    
>> Thanks for any help
>>    
>> Todd
>>
>>    
>>
>>    
>>